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kiplingkat
(Tue Jul 22 09:09:22)
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 UPDATED Tue Jul 22 11:50:35 |
I'm currently reading the Sil and actually enjoying it a great deal. But as my background is in history and mythology, while Tolkien's writing style seems "dry" to the average reader, I find it very evocative of ancient myth.
One thing we've all commented on at one point or another is Tolkien lack of character development as we know it in modern literature. One thing I noticed that reinforces this idea is the lack of dialogue in ancient myth and Tolkien. People don't converse, and if they speak it is prose at a point of heightened drama.
When one thinks about oral tradition, this actually makes sense. It's very hard to engage an audience with constant back and forth of "He said....", "And then he said..." and then "She said....". The orator would only actually step into the role of a character and speak to draw the audience further in a heighten tension.
In a literate society, where everyone reads, dialogue has become far more common because we can differentiate in our mind who is speaking. We can hear the different voices in our head, as opposed to the sole voice of the orator.
I also thought about the use of meter in Oral tradition, used both to facilitate memorization and as an additional trick to keep the audience engaged. Most written literature has done away with this, though I think the truly great authors still use it.
This is only the beginnings of true analysis, but it was an interesting thought and I'd be interested in hearing what other folks think on the matter.
from rise to set sweats in the eye of Phoebus and all night sleeps in Elysium
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Interesting observations, Kip! 
One thing I noticed that reinforces this idea is the lack of dialogue in ancient myth and Tolkien. People don't converse, and if they speak it is prose at a point of heightened drama.
Actually, I think that people did indeed converse and that Tolkien chose not to reveal to us all their dialogues. For example, when Aredhel and Maeglin are escaping from Eõl, it is written that mother and son merely fled. Tolkien does not record any conversation between them, but that does not indicate that they never spoke a word throughout their entire journey. While I believe that if two or three characters conversed together and Tolkien recorded their dialogue, he recorded the whole thing, I do not think that he bothered to write down every single conversation.
I never connected the use of meter and Tolkien before! Now I know why so many stories ("The Lay of Beleriand," etc) of his were writ in poetry, with meter and all.
 You are a daughter of kings. A shieldmaiden of Rohan.
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Well, we're talking about how stories are told, not the characters themselves. I'm sure Agamemnon and Achillies and Odysseus talked a great deal, humans beings in contact with one another do, but Homer didn't record it. He didn't feel that it fit in in how he told his story to his audience (orally). If you read ancient myths, which began as stories told around a hearth or by temple priests, there are almost no conversations. The Sil fits in with that mode of storytelling.
Tokien made the same choice with the Sil, the style he chose to write it in does not record conversations.
from rise to set sweats in the eye of Phoebus and all night sleeps in Elysium
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Yes, I realise that. Thanks for helping me make another connexion, Kip. I often have the material to make such connexions, but don't have the wits to see it. 
You are a daughter of kings. A shieldmaiden of Rohan.
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This doesn't have to do with the oral tradition as much as with themes in ancient myths. One theme that comes to mind is gift-giving. It is a big part of ancient myths and was very important in ancient societies. If I remember right, there are a several instances of this in Tolkien (Galadriel's gifts to the fellowship, the dwarves' gifts to Bilbo, and I'm sure there are many more in the Sil).
Also, several characters are archetypes more than individuals, another theme in ancient myth. Aragorn embodies courage, loyalty and dignity. Boromir embodies patriotism and lust for power. Sam also embodies loyalty and courage, as well as friendship and steadfastness.
On a hot summer night would you offer your throat to the wolf with the red rose?
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"I sang of leaves, of leaves of gold, and leaves of gold there grew..."
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sinaes
(Tue Aug 5 01:48:54)
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I'm like a good haines t-shirt: tagless 
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Not idly do the leaves of Lorien fall
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